What if Donald loses on election night?

[cliffs]

So if Donald gets to sue over states Biden won, can Biden do the same for Donald's states and really hold up the will of Americans.

[cliffs]

WASHINGTON (AP) — President Donald Trump is testing how far he can go in using the trappings of presidential power to undermine confidence in this week's election against Joe Biden, as the Democrat gained ground in tight contests in key battleground states — and then inched ahead in Georgia.

With his pathway to reelection appearing to shrink, Trump on Thursday advanced unsupported accusations of voter fraud to falsely argue that his rival was trying to seize power. It amounted to an extraordinary effort by a sitting American president to sow doubt about the democratic process.

“This is a case when they are trying to steal an election, they are trying to rig an election,” Trump said from the podium of the White House briefing room.




Isn't this fun...only rigged on the dem side of things.

[LKeet6]

Just want to say cliffs, you and this anonymous stranger in here have been smashing it with all the posts.

Just wish they could be posted over there. Especially the ones CLEARLY outlining how baseless and absurd the "fraud" claims are...

[Dump Trump 2020]

Donald Trump’s campaign has filed a slew of last-ditch lawsuits this week in what seems to be a clear effort to try to drag out vote counting and create a cloud of uncertainty over an election he is on the verge of losing. But legal experts have noted that the lawsuits appear to be long shots and even if successful, they would not change the outcome of the race.

The Trump campaign is taking legal action in Pennsylvania, Georgia, Michigan, and Nevada - all battleground states Trump has either lost (such as the state of Michigan) or faces a tough fight to win. In each case, his campaign has loudly trumpeted the filings of suits with allegations that include counting late-arriving ballots, campaign observers not having adequate access to poll counting, and invalid votes being tabulated.

So far, the legal battle is not going well. The Trump campaign lost two suits on Thursday in Michigan and Georgia.

“They all seem to have no merit whatsoever,” said Joshua Douglas, a law professor at the University of Kentucky who focuses on elections. “I think the goal is to sow discord and distrust and undermine the people and the integrity of the election. I think giving them additional air time just plays into that theory.”

Trump has repeatedly called for halting the vote counting process as Joe Biden continues to close in on Trump’s vote totals in Pennsylvania and Georgia. The totals are shifting because Democrats overwhelmingly voted by mail. Counting those votes can take longer than processing in-person votes because election officials have to verify information on ballot envelopes and then physically remove them from their envelopes before they are counted. In Pennsylvania, officials were prohibited by state law from starting to count ballots until election day, leading to a lengthy count.

On Thursday, Trump’s campaign also announced a suit in Nevada over alleged irregular votes, but it offered no concrete evidence for its claims. The campaign also lost in two of the suits it filed. In Georgia, a judge dismissed a case in Chatham county in which the campaign alleged 53 ballots that missed the deadline to be counted were mingled with valid ballots (the campaign did not have evidence the small group of ballots actually arrived late and election officials testified the ballots arrived on time).

In Michigan, a judge dismissed a suit from the campaign that alleged poll observers were not being given “meaningful access” to ballot counting and that campaign observers should be given recorded video footage of drop boxes. The judge said there was not a legal basis requiring officials to turn over surveillance footage and that the state had already issued an order requiring observer access, according to the Detroit Free Press. The judge also said officials had already completed counting, so the request was moot.

“It could be reflex. On most people, if you hit their patellar tendon with a small rubber mallet, you get a knee jerk. With Trump, it’s possible that if you hit his patellar tendon with a small rubber mallet, you get a lawsuit,” said Justin Levitt, a law professor at Loyola Law School in Los Angeles.

“It could be a misguided sense that this sort of litigation will cast enough doubt on the election process that it somehow ends up in a declaration by the courts that undoes the will of the people (in the event that the count doesn’t go his way),” he added. “I think there are a lot of missing steps between filing a lawsuit and that final declaration.”

Bob Bauer, a top election attorney for Joe Biden’s campaign, told reporters Trump’s suits were part of an effort to “create an opportunity for them to message falsely about what’s taking place in the electoral process”.

Republicans on Thursday also withdrew a case challenging how certain mail-in ballots were handled in a suburban Philadelphia county. The case appeared focused on just 98 votes, according to the Philadelphia Inquirer, and Republicans appeared poised to lose.

Losses aside, the Trump campaign did secure an order in Philadelphia allowing observers to get closer to workers counting ballots. The decision led to a dramatic appearance by two top Trump campaign surrogates, Pam Bondi, the former Florida attorney general, and Corey Lewandowski, Trump’s former campaign manager.

Standing in front of Trump supporters waving campaign flags and holding signs that said “voting ends on election day”, the two held up a printed copy of the order and announced they were going inside for access. Counting in the convention center briefly stopped while election officials figured out how to accommodate the order, then resumed, according to the Philadelphia Inquirer.

Despite lack of evidence, the messaging has hit home with some Trump supporters, who have been showing up to demonstrations at election centers across the country. One of the supporters standing outside the convention center was Elio Forcina, who traveled to Philadelphia from New York City and said he didn’t trust the local elections officials to conduct an accurate count. (There’s no evidence of fraud and officials have not reported irregularities.)

“There’s no way of actually counting whether or not the mail-in votes are correct,” he said, even though officials have numerous procedures in place to verify ballots.

Philadelphia officials appealed the observer decision to the state supreme court and the Trump campaign later filed a separate suit in federal court alleging they were still being denied access and asking a judge to enforce the order. But in court, a lawyer for the campaign admitted that observers had been granted access, prompting the judge to reportedly ask: “I’m sorry, then what’s your problem?”

Douglas noted that even if the Trump campaign won its effort to increase observer access to the count, there still was not evidence of fraud or wrongdoing.

“That’s great to have people observing the process. If it took a court order to have that kind of transparency, OK,” said Douglas. “That doesn’t mean there’s something nefarious going on that we should be concerned about.”

[cliffs]

The saddest part of all this bullshit from the GOP/WH is we have to live with this loser for another 2 1/2 months and I would not want to be anyone in his admin that has crossed him in any way.

[Make America hate again 2020]

This will be a conspiracy theory that sticks. No doubt.

There is no way the massive section of trump's fans who are maniacs will EVER accept a biden win.

So we will now forever see endless comments online about a "fake election" and anger will be even higher once biden is the president. The country will remain divided, probably moreso.

That's what this irresponsible and reckless behaviour will lead to. But hey, ever since trump started campaigning for the republican nomination he's been reckless and irresponsible, so this is just the natural conclusion to it all...

[Tiny Hands 2020]

A day after Donald Trump leveled baseless claims about the election from a White House lectern, it was clear that his supporters standing outside the Pennsylvania convention center, where workers are counting ballots, heard him clearly.

Chanting “let us see the vote,” many in the group repeatedly said that Republicans were not being allowed inside the convention center, an untrue claim Trump made Thursday.

“We’re here for the millions of Americans who stood in line for hours to cast non absent votes for the president and who are being disenfranchised right now behind me by people who will not let us legally watch, who are keeping the poll watchers and the candidates 20 feet away. You cannot see anything,” said Joanne Young, a protester.

Observers from both parties have been allowed in. The Trump campaign secured a court order on Thursday requiring local election officials to allow observers to get up to six feet closer to observe the process. A Trump campaign attorney conceded in federal court that the party had observers inside the hall.

A woman who would only give her first name, Kathy, said that it was obvious Democrats were cheating because vote totals were consistently being added to Joe Biden’s vote totals. The reason that’s happening is because Democrats overwhelmingly voted by mail-in ballot, which take longer to count, while Trump supporters voted in person.

Kathy also said that Trump had watermarked all of the ballots and all the fake ones would come out this week. Such a watermark would be impossible - elections in the United States are run by the states at the local level. The president has no access to ballots or role in administering elections.

Valerie Fiorinno said she had observed the mail-in process and believed there were many ways to cheat. Election officials and voters closely track and verify ballots.

“I will never see him as legitimately elected,” she said of Joe Biden. '

I'm sorry, but these people are, quite simply, not very intelligent people...

[cliffs]

Philadelphia mayor: Trump needs to 'put his big boy pants on' and concede
At a press briefing about the ongoing vote count operation Friday, Jim Kenney, the Democratic mayor of Philadelphia, offered some unsolicited advice to President Trump.

"I think what the president needs to do is, frankly, put his big boy pants on. He needs to acknowledge the fact that he lost," Kenney said. "He needs to congratulate the winner, just as Jimmy Carter did, just as George H.W. Bush did and frankly just as Al Gore did, and stop this and let us move forward as a country."

[cliffs]

"People around Trump are working to identify who might be able to communicate to him the stark reality," CNN reports. "There has been talk of potentially Jared Kushner or Ivanka Trump, though their willingness to lead a difficult intervention wasn't clear."



One way of doing so that has been discussed, CNN writes, is "framing potential conversations with Trump around the idea of preserving his brand for life after being president," and The New York Times also reports that Republicans are discussing how to bring up with Trump "what leaving quietly could mean for his family, his business and his own ability to remain in politics."



But according to CNN, Trump has "given virtually no thought" to the idea that he might not win a second term, and that idea was "not discussed widely among his team." He also reportedly does not have a concession speech prepared.



Trump has reportedly told people he does not intend to concede the race, and Axios' Jonathan Swan writes that "nobody I have spoken to on the campaign or in the White House believes that Trump would ever publicly acknowledge a loss, even long after the election is certified." The Times similarly reports that while some believe Trump could ultimately concede if a loss becomes clear, "he will most likely never publicly accept the result" of the election.

[Dump Trump 2020]

Trump and his people's new attack line- "I thought you said Russia rigged the election, now you're saying the election can't be rigged??"

A few points in riposte:

- they were talking about a previous election, not this one.
- they were talking about republicans not democrats.
- they didn't say it was rigged they said it was tampered with.
- they didn't say ANYTHING about the number of votes being faked, they were talking about campaigning BEFORE the election.
- THEY HAD EVIDENCE!!

But then republicans don't go with logic and rationale, do they; they go with zero evidence claims and false equivalences.

[cliffs]

Former President George W. Bush issued a rare public statement on Sunday, congratulating President-elect Joe Biden on his victory and also giving a nod to President Trump’s unsuccessful reelection bid.

"I just talked to the president-elect of the United States, Joe Biden. I extended my warm congratulations and thanked him for the patriotic message he delivered last night," Bush said.

“I also called Kamala Harris to congratulate her on her historic election to the vice presidency,” Bush said of Vice President-elect Kamala Harris, a California senator who shattered gender and racial barriers with her win.

"No matter how you voted, your vote counted," Bush said. "The American people can have confidence that this election was fundamentally fair, its integrity will be upheld, and its outcome is clear."

The 43rd president added: “I want to congratulate President Trump and his supporters on a hard-fought campaign. He earned the votes of more than 70 million Americans — an extraordinary political achievement. They have spoken, and their voices will continue to be heard through elected Republicans at every level of government.”

[cliffs]

Maybe we should wait for the election to be over, eh?  LOL

[Tiny Hands 2020]

"Donald Trump has set up a retirement GoFundMe. Well, not exactly – he doesn’t call it a retirement GoFundMe, but his “election defense fund”.

Those donating may believe that the money will be used to go towards challenging the election result, but may have missed that their contributions are earmarked for paying off Trump’s re-election debts. It seems to be the latest episode in the Trump team’s comedy of errors.

As Trump continues to refuse to acknowledge the election result by baselessly claiming that Biden’s victory was won through voter fraud, he is also calling on his base for help. Donations can be made to two different funds – Trump’s personal fund, and his joint fund with the RNC.

“President Trump needs YOU to step up to make sure we have the resources to protect the integrity of the election!” the wording on both funds says, which is featured in a huge pop-up on Trump’s re-election webpage. It continues: “Please contribute ANY AMOUNT IMMEDIATELY to the Official Election Defense Fund and to increase your impact by 1,000%!”

It is unclear who matches the donations.

But if you scroll down, past the information about the “Left-wing MOB” trying to “undermine our election”, you’ll see some fine print. On Trump’s personal fund, it dictates that of all donations raised, only 50% will go towards a recount effort, and that “50% of each contribution, up to a maximum of $2,800 ($5,000), [will] be designated toward DJTFP’s 2020 general election account for general election debt retirement until such debt is retired”.

Trump raised 1.6bill and spent 1.4bill (over 2 years) on campaigning for the election.

BILLION!!

[cliffs]

Trump expected to launch leadership PAC

President Trump is expected to launch a leadership PAC as soon as this month, according to Trump campaign officials, who argue its creation was always in the works, “win or lose.”

This would allow Trump to raise money once he leaves office as an intermediary vehicle and as he contemplates a potential 2024 run. Funds raised could pay for his travel and political consultants over the next few years, for example.

“The president always planned to do this, win or lose, so he can support candidates and issues he cares about, such as combating voter fraud,” campaign spokesman Tim Murtaugh told NBC News in a statement.

Allies have been discussing this possibility with the president for some time, NBC News has reported. Even before the election, Trump had doubts that he would win. The president told advisers in the weeks before Nov. 3 that he would consider a presidential run in 2024 if he lost, according to a person familiar with the conversations. Trump has mentioned the idea again over the past week, and his allies have discussed the possibility of him setting up a super PAC.




As long as my tax money does not go to this clown, then go ahead fools...donate away. I guess I was wrong when I thought "if he loses we don't have to put up with monthly rallies", oh well.

[LKeet6]

I probably should post as me now

I stopped watching John Oliver when him and his team did a boringly predictable hatchet job on maduro and venezuala, but have been enjoying him recently. Him and his team are usually really good at research and going in-depth on stuff.

Here's a good summation, with a bit more detail, of all the BS behind the "fruad." Some highlights: A sample of 50 from the list of "14 thousand dead people who voted in wayne county" showed 37 were dead and hadn't voted, 5 had voted but were alive, and 8 were alive and hadn't voted." So NOT all dead, and NOT all voted! Fuck sake. And the one Tucker (most punchable face ever) and others ran with about the dead guy who voted, was his wife.